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Post by deeniereenie on Dec 28, 2020 14:24:35 GMT -5
www.yahoo.com/news/cheerleaders-vulgar-message-prompts-first-131037750.htmlGist of the story: A cheerleader was unhappy she failed to make varsity. She posted a snapchat that said "F cheer, F softball, F school, F everything" One of the other students she sent it to showed their mom, girl was kicked of squad for a year. Sued the school, saying her right to free speech was violated. The 3rd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, in Philadelphia said the school has no right to punish students for statements made off of school property. The Supreme Court is set to hear the case next month. I am of 2 minds on this. I do agree that students should have the right to express themselves freely, in their private time. But at the same time, I do feel like actions have consequences, and coaches/mentors of extracurricular activities should be able to say "this person doesn't represent our school values." Maybe because I have been on the receiving end of public comments on social media about how awful our school/a certain teacher/policies are, with no recourse to defend myself, I do not think the school overstepped by saying she couldn't cheer for a year. But I do think a year is slightly excessive. Maybe sit out a few games? What say you?
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Post by Inky on Dec 28, 2020 14:51:40 GMT -5
No debate here. I agree with you. Actions have consequences and within 10 years or so, young people are going to finally GET that. But right now, many of them don't. And what about future employers? Isn't school supposed to prepare you for the real world? Go online and diss a company then try and get a job there a year or two later.
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Post by villanelle on Dec 28, 2020 15:33:59 GMT -5
I think that it's a bit petulant for the school to kick her off the team for it. She was a disgruntled teen throwing a benign tempter tantrum. Off the team for a year seems excessive and almost like someone is getting in a pissing match with a teenage girl. Stupid.
But I also don't agree that a school shouldn't have the right to punish a student for an activity just because it was off-campus. If she had posted a death threat against the cheer coach (or perhaps just a 'wish' that the cheer coach be killed in a specific, apinful way, so that her statement was in no way breaking a law)or a list of students she would like to see killed in a school shooting, would be still be okay with "it was off campus so out of our sphere of influence"?
I would like for the school to have the right to do what it did, but I think in this specific case, they shouldn't have done it. But doing something different and lesser (suspended for 2 cheer events, perhaps) would still be punishing her for something that happened off-campus.
I'm also curious of the "can't punish for things off-campus" includes breaking laws. If a football player gets a DUI and underage drinking citation off campus, must they still let him play?
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Post by villanelle on Dec 28, 2020 15:36:16 GMT -5
I think that it's a bit petulant for the school to kick her off the team for it. She was a disgruntled teen throwing a benign tempter tantrum. Off the team for a year seems excessive and almost like someone is getting in a pissing match with a teenage girl. Stupid.
But I also don't agree that a school shouldn't have the right to punish a student for an activity just because it was off-campus. If she had posted a death threat against the cheer coach (or perhaps just a 'wish' that the cheer coach be killed in a specific, apinful way, so that her statement was in no way breaking a law)or a list of students she would like to see killed in a school shooting, would be still be okay with "it was off campus so out of our sphere of influence"?
I would like for the school to have the right to do what it did, but I think in this specific case, they shouldn't have done it. But doing something different and lesser (suspended for 2 cheer events, perhaps) would still be punishing her for something that happened off-campus.
I'm also curious of the "can't punish for things off-campus" includes breaking laws. If a football player gets a DUI and underage drinking citation off campus, must they still let him play?
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Post by deeniereenie on Dec 28, 2020 16:13:26 GMT -5
I taught night school for a couple of years, before they switched how they were doing that. A lot of our students there were kids with an arrest record. They were not allowed on campus during the school day, so were not able to do extracurriculars.
I know of several students who have been forced off a team/activity due to behavior, but those all happened in the course of a school day. My thought is that if teachers can be fired/reprimanded for things that happen outside of school hours (legal things of course), then the same should apply to students.
I do think a year is excessive, and that should not have happened, but I also don't know if this was the *only* thing that happened, or the straw that broke the camel's back. I may be reading too much into the situation, because I know that way too often, there are not consequences for actions that do happen at school, if the parent is someone known to be abrasive. I have those parents in kindergarten (not this year, strangely enough!) EVERYTHING is someone else's fault.
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Post by GiftOfFlavor on Dec 28, 2020 17:13:57 GMT -5
“Free Speech” in the United States doesn’t mean her speech is “free from any and all consequence”. It means the government isn’t allowed to silence her for disagreeing with them. I’m pretty sure she needs to pay more attention in civics class...
If what she said violated some sort of policy and she was punished then so be it.
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Post by momof3b1g on Dec 28, 2020 17:43:32 GMT -5
My oldest 2 played soccer in hs and my 3rd son is in marching band. They all had a contract they signed which basically stated they would conduct themselves in such a way as to be "representative" of the school. I think she deserved something and likely removing her from the team was the best course of action based on her display of "unsportsmanlike conduct" - I do feel this was a bit excessive but they didn't suspend/expel her and they didn't hamper her studies. Extracurriculars are a privilege, not a right.
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Post by Tpatt100 on Dec 29, 2020 13:08:38 GMT -5
I think people have a right to privacy but when you post it on social media you no longer care about privacy, you want attention and more often than not the attention can have consequences.
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Post by nansel on Dec 29, 2020 15:04:31 GMT -5
I think people have a right to privacy but when you post it on social media you no longer care about privacy, you want attention and more often than not the attention can have consequences. Exactly. Posting on social media is about as private as standing in front of the school yelling it.
Extra-curriculars are a privilege, and losing those seems to be the consequence in this case. I think it's totally appropriate.
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Post by justthinking on Dec 29, 2020 16:22:04 GMT -5
I agree with tpatt. She was not speaking privately. She was intentionally public. One of the big downsides of social media is it gives people the ability to spew to the whole world what they would have--in previous generations--screamed into their pillow.
I also think a one year ban is excessive, though I don't know how a girl goes about mending relationships with the team and coaches after putting that out their publicly, and I think those relationships are important on a cheer team.
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Post by shannont on Dec 29, 2020 23:14:28 GMT -5
Without knowing the school policy and how that policy has been enforced, I can’t make a judgement on this. If, the policy was in place, she was aware of it and had been enforced on previous occasions with other students, welp, thems the breaks kiddo.
If this was a knee jerk reaction not sanctioned by policy, I think she had a case.
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Post by Mamapalooza on Dec 30, 2020 0:12:35 GMT -5
A year is excessive. Yes, actions have consequences, including speech. But the restrictions against speech should always be a very high bar.
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Post by alicechalmers on Dec 30, 2020 0:23:06 GMT -5
A year is massively excessive, and shows that the school is less mature than the teenager.
While I do not think that off-school actions should never be addressed by the school, I do think schools should reserve it for when it really matters. A disappointed teen venting to her friends? Leave her the hell alone.
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Post by kimbelina on Jan 5, 2021 15:03:05 GMT -5
A year is massively excessive, and shows that the school is less mature than the teenager. While I do not think that off-school actions should never be addressed by the school, I do think schools should reserve it for when it really matters. A disappointed teen venting to her friends? Leave her the hell alone. I agree. And I keep coming back to it's Snapchat. The posts disappear after 24 hours so why bother reporting it? If it was an actual threat, then sure report it, but venting her frustrations? Leave it alone. |
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